For
their third duo album together Jeff Johnson and Phil Keaggy
return with Cappadocia. Although a sonic
tribute to a haven in Turkey for Christians fleeing persecution, the
all-instrumental Cappadocia is truly a masterpiece of modern
day New Age and Celtic flavored contemporary instrumental sounds.
Haunting melodic themes are fleshed out and brought to life via Jeffs
magisterial synth keyboards and Phils one-of-a-kind electric
and acoustic guitar sound. Both musicians add in tasteful percussion
backing and occasional vocals. Fans of both of these world-class musicians
that were blessed enough to hear their earlier albumsFrio
Suite (2009) and Watersky (2012) will be amazed at
the wealth of musical concepts on Cappadocia. Speaking
about the depth and variety of music on Cappadocia, Jeff Johnson
tells mwe3.com, "One of the biggest challenges that Ive
always faced with the music that I make is how exactly to categorize
it. With the collaboration that Ive had with Irish flutist,
Brian Dunning, its a bit easier with using the label, Contemporary
Celtic. Yet with the music that Phil and I make, there are so
many different elements and genres represented here that I honestly
dont know what to call it other than contemporary instrumental
which doesnt begin to describe the details! I believe that this
music has a fairly broad appeal. There really is no targeted
market other than reaching the fans that have enjoyed our music
on the past two recordings and expanding it to new listeners. Since
its instrumental and contemporary, its going to get put
in the New Age genre category which is fine. But because
theres an inspiration from the Christian heritage and spirituality
of Cappadocia it might also be appreciated by those who enjoy Christian
music. And, because theres a sophisticated structure and thoughtfulness
in both the compositions and the recording production, it might appeal
to a new classical audience. And finally, since theres
that tinge of progressive rock here and there, it might
also be something the prog rock folks enjoy when they want to chill
a bit!"
Although New Age and neoclassical in scope, the entire Cappadocia
album also presents itself as a kind of modern day symphonic-sounding
progressive rock masterpiecealbeit one that lulls you in with
a very stately rock sound, complete with unforgettable, atmospheric
musical vibes. Clearly one of the most influential and anticipated
album releases of late 2018 and early 2019, Cappadocia is essential
listening and an album not to be missed among fans of Jeff Johnson
and Phil Keaggy. www.jeffjohnsonmusic.bandcamp.com
/ www.youtube.com
/ www.arkmusic.com
/ www.philkeaggy.com
mwe3.com presents an interview with
JEFF JOHNSON and PHIL KEAGGY
mwe3:
The new album Cappadocia is the best album yet by you. You
traveled all the way to Turkey to visit friends of yours that ran
a Christian retreat ministry. Were you apprehensive traveling to Turkey
as its in quite a tumultuous place these days in the Middle
East? You mentioned how impressed you were by the spirituality of
the place. Did you only go to Cappadocia or did you travel in other
places in Turkey and how does Cappadocia hold relevance for you today?
Jeff Johnson: As a tourist, Turkey is really not as tumultuous
as portrayed in the news. The people are great and even in Istanbul,
my wife and I felt perfectly safe. Having said that, it was somewhat
overwhelming to see so many refugees from the Syrian conflict living
in Istanbul and it really brought the news home seeing how this conflict
had so deeply affected so many families.
Our friends live in Kas, a small village on the mediterranean just
west of the larger city, Antalya. We spent some time exploring that
area as well as Istanbul on our own. Yet, the bulk of our time was
spent in the Cappadocia region. Cappadocia has a rich history and
is a place where Eastern Christianity has deep roots. All that remains
today of this are the countless stone carved churches and other buildings
which are literally all over the region. There is hardly any Christian
subculture, let alone churches, that exist there anymore. But if you
put the experience of being in this place with the rich history that
is associated with it together, youll begin to appreciate and
be overwhelmed by what youre seeing and experiencing there.
mwe3: How has the Cappadocia area of Turkey changed
over the years? You mentioned references going back to the 4th century.
How did they create churches underground 1500 years ago and what or
who were the Christians fleeing from back then? Theres still
Christians being persecuted there? Plus you said these underground
churches are still in tact and there were in fact, hundreds of these
churches at one time in ancient Turkey which is amazing.
Jeff
Johnson: The answer to your first couple of questions here could
take up an entire interview and preferably with someone other than
me that has researched the rich and varied history of Cappadocia.
We know that there were converts to Christianity from their mention
in Acts with the pouring out of the Holy Spirit in Jerusalem amongst
what would have been Jews from the area. Paul of Tarsus mentions and
probably visited young congregations of Christians on his missionary
journeys there, too. Later, it would be a place that Christians would
flee to escaping persecution from the Roman Empire. There are not
church congregations there now, as far as I know, Turkey is a Muslim
country.
mwe3: You noted that there are some mid-Eastern sounds on Cappadocia,
yet the album sounds very much like you and your best music and
is very classic New Age meets rock instrumental in nature. Would you
say the album is almost futuristic sounding in nature and how does
the percussion link the music? Its not loud drumming but very
effective percussion.
Jeff Johnson: We didnt want to use a lot of cliché
"middle eastern sounds in the music. Yet, Phil did borrow
a Cumbus - a sort of Turkish oud meets banjo kind of instrument
- for the title track which I thought was pretty neat. I utilized
several middle eastern drum samples in what I did on some of the percussion
treatments, as well, but the music still pretty much stays within
the signature sounds that Phil and I have each brought to our collaboration
together.
When I create the percussion tracks, I try to pick sounds and patterns
that support the composition rather than take it over. Plus, these
songs each feature a number and are made up of numerous musical movements
so you cant just pick a loop and have it go through the whole
composition. There has to almost be an orchestral approach
to the percussion as the music moves between the various sections
that make up each piece.
You mentioned the rock element of some of the featured sections in
this music. I loved the fact that Phil brought out the electric guitar
more on Cappadocia than hes done on the past two
albums!
mwe3: Tell us something about how the two of you combined melodic
ideas. Was it done where one would add a part or a mid section or
add a melodic line to complete a musical idea? Can you give an example
or a track or two where the two of your collaborated on a key musical
idea on the Cappadocia CD? You are clearly getting better at
it after three groundbreaking albums.
Jeff
Johnson: Phil and I work and record in our own studios and send
tracks back and forth to one another. One of us has an initial idea
and sort of maps it out and then sends it off for the other person
to add his bits. That process goes back and forth, on and on until
I begin really arranging and mixing what weve been doing into
a more coherent piece. Yet even though Im doing the final mix
of the piece in my studio, Phil is very involved with ideas and suggestions
as I send him various versions of mixes.
mwe3: What about the gear on the album? I read Phil used a
number of different guitar and fretboard instruments on Cappadocia.
Also were new keyboards added or used in the making of Cappadocia
compared to the Frio Suite and WaterSky albums?
Can you tell us how you got such a great sound onto the disc and
who helped you in attaining the very
high-techsound?
What were some of the recording sessions like on this truly exemplary
sounding album?
Jeff Johnson: On this project, I recorded my tracks using Logic
X and an UA Apollo 8 interface using programs from Spectrasonics,
Synthogy, Korg, Native Instruments, Celemony and United Audio. I mixed
digitally via a T.C. Electronic Finalizer into an Alesis MasterLink
using Yamaha NS10s and Stax Headphones for monitoring. My keyboard
controller was a Yamaha P250.
Both Phil and I know how to get what we want in our recording set
up and I were really comfortable with the process we have of
sending tracks back and forth to one another. Theres a keen
trust that we share and weve come to really understand and anticipate
what the other person is trying to do when they send along their ideas.
Thats something thats been honed over the past ten years
of making music with one another and it seems like it all really came
together in the making of this new CD.
Phil Keaggy: On this project, I used guitars made by James
Olson Acoustic Guitars, Del Langejans Classical Guitars, Lukas Brunner
Baritone 12 string guitars, Kenny Marshall and Ken Hoovers Zion
Guitars
I also played a Gibson Les Paul, Fender Strat, Gibson G3 Bass, Yamaha
Fretless Bass, Oceana Ukulele, Turkish Cumbus and a Loar Mandolin.
I recorded through a Vox AC 30 and a Vox MV50, a LaChapell 992 Tube
Preamplifier with Audix and Audio Technica Microphones all into my
computer based Pro Tools 11.
mwe3:
Even though Cappadocia is steeped in ancient Christian lore,
its a very accessible album that sounds more like 21st century
New Age progressive rock in scope. Do you feel it is also like a type
of modern 21st century classical music and who is your targeted market,
New Age, classical, Christian music, even progressive rock?
Jeff Johnson: One of the biggest challenges that Ive
always faced with the music that I make is how exactly to categorize
it. With the collaboration that Ive had with Irish flutist,
Brian Dunning, its a bit easier with using the label, Contemporary
Celtic. Yet with the music that Phil and I make, there are so
many different elements and genres represented here that I honestly
dont know what to call it other than contemporary instrumental
which doesnt begin to describe the details!
I believe that this music has a fairly broad appeal. There really
is no targeted market other than reaching the fans that
have enjoyed our music on the past two recordings and expanding it
to new listeners. Since its instrumental and contemporary, its
going to get put in the New Age genre category which is fine. But
because theres an inspiration from the Christian heritage and
spirituality of Cappadocia it might also be appreciated by
those who enjoy Christian music. And, because theres a sophisticated
structure and thoughtfulness in both the compositions and the recording
production, it might appeal to a new classical audience.
And finally, since theres that tinge of progressive rock
here and there, it might also be something the prog rock folks enjoy
when they want to chill a bit! Finally, Phil and I both have fairly
broad musical tastes and I think the music we make together sort of
reflects that.
mwe3: You have said that Cappadocia is a concept album.
If you could explain the album concept to someone looking to hear
it, how would you explain it? You grew up with progressive rock in
your ears and so its fitting that Cappadocia has a strong
connection to prog, one that retains its grandeur even at lower decibels!
Although this is not unplugged music by any stretch of
the imagination.
Jeff
Johnson: This music is conceptual both compositionally
and thematically. Compositionally in that an idea is begun and then
explored, taken apart, left behind and then returned to in each piece.
Thematically, because Phil and I explore several aspects of the rich
culture and historical tapestry that comes out of Cappadocia throughout
the album.
Its also conceptual as an entire piece... we recorded it and
put it together designed as a complete listening experience. Thats
just like how both Phil and I grew up listening to music where you
came home with the latest LP and sat down and listened to it in its
entirety. Thats what we were going for with Cappadocia.
Both Phil and I love to take people places with our music.
And even if one only listens to one song on the album, that song is
sort of a mini version of a concept album in that its made up
of several varying movements and musical ideas.
mwe3:
I want
to ask about some of tracks on Cappadocia. What can you telll us
about the title track Cappadocia?
Jeff: Once Phil and I got into this one, it soon became the
main theme for the whole CD project thanks to some of the eastern
sounds that I incorporated with Phils Turkish Cumbus lines.
One of my favorite sections on the whole album is when Phil sings
the melody in the middle of this and then comes back to it at the
end of the song. I also love the transition to the electric guitar
solo and how it modulates back to the main theme with all of the parts
coming together.
Phil: Jeff had the initial idea and theme for this song and
I enjoyed adding my various guitars and fretless bass, including the
Zion electric guitar solo, which recalls my March Of The Clouds
from 1985. I take over with my own musical thoughts around the 3:00
mark before returning to the beginning theme at the end.
mwe3:
How about track four,
Parousia
(A Presence)?
Phil: This is a composition that I initiated. Jeffs contribution
of piano work is understated but extremely beautiful! The classical
guitar references Deep Calls Unto Deep (Master and
The Musician). I also played the chumbus on this one as well.
Its a simple, recurring theme that builds quite nicely enhanced
by the relationship between the bass and Jeffs percussion work.
Jeff: I remember hearing the rough for the first time and just
feeling overwhelmed by the beauty of the piece. Parousia
can mean a second coming or simply a presence.
I hear a beautiful presence in the music of this song.
So much of this piece was already worked out by Phil, so I have to
find my spaces and lines in that. I approach the process
as a puzzle to be solved. This piece has a lovely eastern-sounding
element to it as well along with some wonderful transitions between
sections, which never loose site of Phils original guitar melody.
mwe3:
Also the
track That
Which Is Hidden is another highlight.
Jeff: The very first piece we recorded for the project, I came
up with what I thought was a lovely chord progression with the synth
pad and wanted to just play it for ever! The title suggests something
a friend of mine once told me, We know God better because he
has hidden himself. There is a point that the opening chords
stop and a simple guitar line transitions into the same chord progression
thats taken over by the piano and Phils counter guitar
lines. The way forward compositionally was to discover that
which was hidden in that opening progression! After several
diverse sections of this piece, Phil comes back to the chords at the
very end of the song.
Phil: I love how this piece builds. Its an example of
how a composition can slowly develop and eventually open up vistas
of imagery that can be breathtaking. As with Jeffs other pieces
he initially sent me, he allowed me to create the back half and then
takes my musical ideas to a new sonic level. Instruments used: Brunner
Bari 12 string and Langejans classical guitars throughout. The electric
guitars give a slight reference to music from the 1960s.
mwe3:
A favorite track from Cappadocia, Chapel of Stone
sounds very jazzy and progressive in the best sense of the word. What
were some of your most lasting impressions of being inside a church
carved out of rock?
Jeff Johnson: When I was in Cappadocia, my friend who lives
in Turkey took me to this incredible carved out church completely
hidden from the outside. This was no cave but a small cathedral with
columns and a vaulted ceiling. The acoustic in this place was otherworldly!
The music here sort of explores this space with its main sanctuary
and connecting rooms including a large dovecot on the second floor.
The vocals that Phil and I add at the end sort of represent the echoes
from voices past that would have sung chant in this place.
Phil
Keaggy: This is a composition that I initiated and, like many
of the other songs on the album, develops and takes the listener to
places they wouldnt initially expect! I explored Spanish, bluegrass,
old-time and even added some subtle mandolin on this.
mwe3: The final track Trinity
does it refer
to the 3 albums you and Phil have made thus far and also, can you
tell us its connection to the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit? Its
truly a remarkable track. It almost has a country rock kind of vibe
to it. Phils guitar solo is wonderful too.
Phil: This was another nod to the early days of my musical
journey. I remember playing my Les Paul on the ending solo of Take
Me Closer from Love Broke Through (1976). My longtime
friend, Buck Herring produced that album and the solo I did then felt
inspired. Now, on this piece, we hear the very same guitar as back
then, and I believe it recaptured that musical moment in time.
Jeff: One of the things I enjoy doing is creating the percussion/drum
tracks for these projects. This particular album features a greater
variety of grooves and dynamics than Phil and I have done in the past.
I love the groove of this piece and then how it goes into the pulsing
synth section in the middle to sort of hearken back to some of the
pulsing sections that I do in a couple of the earlier songs. The writings
of Cappodocian Fathers Basil of Caesarea, Gregory of Nazianzus
and Gregory of Nyssa featured the mystical union of the Christian
idea of the Trinity Father, Son and Holy Spirit. They emphasized that
love is at the heart of this union. And its this love, with
all of its beauty and cause for wonder, that whats behind the
music Phil and I create.
mwe3: Cappadocia will do quite well in the Christian
Music sector. What has been the reaction from the Christian music
community? Did your earlier releases Frio Suite and WaterSky
win awards in the Christian music market and what about a possible
Grammy award for Cappadocia?
Jeff Johnson: I hope youre right that folks in the Christian
Music sector will dig this music and support. I honestly dont
know, myself! Phil has an established reputation in that genre and
I do too, to a smaller degree. Yet, I wouldnt think that most
folks who hear this music would think of it as contemporary
Christian music or even praise and worship. In some
sense, its both because Phil and I very much work from our Christian
faith perspective. But at the end of the day, we want to be known
for making good music and thats really our bottom
line.
Both Frio Suite and WaterSky were well received by the
music critics. Yet, we havent won any major music awards and
I rather doubt that Cappadocia will, too. Awards like the Grammys
generally only reflect and concern themselves with the pop music of
a very limited scope of music genres. Thats fine with me. At
the end of the day, Im more satisfied by someone who writes
me and tells me how much the music inspired and moved them. Thats
a good enough award for me.
mwe3: A lot of albums are created on the internet these days
with artists from the whole world playing on the same track. What
are the latest cutting edge technologies for you online? Is the power
of the internet a great boon to your music but do you feel artists
can support themselves and make enough income from online activities?
I see so many banner ad ads for other companies on a youtube page
and countless other web pages featuring the artists music. I
was thinking is that fair?
Jeff
Johnson: As I already mentioned in the conversation about how
Phil and I actually work, were a totally internet based operation.
Yet I think youre referring to how music gets distributed and
supported through the internet. Thats just the reality. Physical
product still plays a role in radio and concert merchandise. Yet most
people listen to their music on the internet. And those ads that you
mentioned popping up as the music gets played is how musicians actually
make some money from this new way of listening. People have gotten
so used to not paying for the music they hear but their totally willing
to see and hear an occasional advertisement and some of the proceeds
from the purchase of those ads goes to supporting the musician who
wrote and recorded the piece of music youre hearing.
Is all of this fair? You tell me! Most musicians make their real money
from performing concerts. Since Phil and I dont tour, were
in a more precarious situation when it comes to trying to make some
money off of the music were making. As there is a record company
(ArkMusic) for these projects, Im doing the best I can with
the resources I have available to me to try to make that process work
to the best of our advantage. So much of the success of ones
music has always been dependent on word of mouth promotion.
There are a lot of folks out there who love what Phil and I are doing
and were banking on them telling their friends!
mwe3: So now youve got these three great albums that
you made. What is the likelihood of a concert performance featuring
the best of the three albums on a DVD and/or what about other plans
for the year of 2019?
Jeff Johnson: As I said above, Phil and I have no plans to
tour this. We tried that a few years back with the WinterSky tour
and, while the music was great to play - we were helped with flutist,
Brian Dunning and violinist, Wendy Goodwin - it was a LOT of work.
To really do this music justice, we would need several other musicians
and some substantial technical and tour support and I just dont
think thats going to happen at this stage of our lives. Phils
quite content to do his solo dates and I love leading retreats, pilgrimages
and contemplative Selah services along with the occasional Celtic
Christmas tour with Brian.
I think thats one of the things thats contributed to the
integrity and quality of what Phil and I have created with these three
albums. Theres never been any pressure on us to make an album
and then tour it. Ten years ago, it began as a musical discussion
over the internet with no time line and no overarching scheme other
than to try to make something that both of us liked. I wouldnt
trade the experience of making these albums with Phil for anything.
Theyve been some of the most enjoyable and, in the end, best
things Ive ever been artistically involved with.