The
world of experimental 20th century music is well over a century old.
20th century recording artists such as Edgard Varese, Luciano Berio
and Wendy Carlos changed the way many music fans listened to music
and although the 20th century is long gone, there’s no turning
back from the breakthroughs of music history. Another name familiar
to most 20th century experimental music fans is Elliott Carter, who
is perhaps metaphysically the subject behind Dark Sonatas,
the 2013 CD from guitarist Kevin Kastning and his U.K. counterpart
and fellow guitar collaborator Mark Wingfield. Known by astute
music followers as the head of Greydisc Records, Kevin Kastning is
not only a musical experimenter but he’s also the inventor of
many guitar breakthroughs, including (but not limited to) the 30 string
guitar, which he implements to great effect on the Dark Sonatas
CD. In contrast to Kastning’s 30 string guitar styles, Mark
Wingfield, on the other hand is an electric guitar practitioner in
the spirit of Allan Holdsworth. If Miles Davis played electric guitar
he might sound like Mark Wingfield. Thankfully, both guitarists are
in top form on Dark Sonatas, which according to the CD liner
notes is greatly impacted by the recorded works of Elliott Carter.
It’s quite interesting to note that Dark Sonatas was recorded
between November 6-8 2012, one day after Elliott Carter passed away
on November 5th, 2012. From the sound of things, do you think Wingfield
and Kastning were channeling Carter’s sonic seasonings? It’s
fascinating to note that for an album as unusual and experimentally
challenging as Dark Sonatas, there’s hardly a note out
of place here. Unlocking a number of sonic covenants, Dark Sonatas
is actually the second album on which Kastning used his 30 string
guitar (the first was the album Nowhere, Now Here with Carl
Clements) and the depth and breadth of the guitar sounds from both
players is quite ear-opening. Featuring 13 tracks that clock in at
62 minutes, Dark Sonatas is quite dynamic in places yet for
the most part, the mixing and mastered CD sound offers a clean and
pristine soundscape. Experimental electric and acoustic guitar recordings
have been quite popular since the 1970s days of messers Fripp, Frith
and Holdsworth. Even so, on Dark Sonatas, Kastning and Wingfield
bring the art of 21st century experimental guitar recordings to a
whole new level of sonic excellence. www.MarkWingfield.com
/ www.KevinKastning.com
mwe3.com presents an interview with
Kevin Kastning
and Mark Wingfield
mwe3: The CD liner notes for Dark Sonatas speak about the influence
of Elliott Carter, who tragically yet quite coincidentally had died
the day before the Dark Sonatas album was recorded. What effect
did Carter and his spirit have on the making of the CD and what music
or recordings from Carter would you cite among his most influential?
Amazingly he lived to be 103 and his last work was actually completed
a few months before he died. What a way to go .. but we should all
live to be a hundred.
Kevin
Kastning: The music of Elliott Carter has long been a tremendous
influence on me and my music. Mark and I maintain a long-running discussion
about his work, as Mark has also been impacted by him. We very deliberately
set out in the recording sessions for the album that would become
Dark Sonatas to structure our real-time compositions using principles
and concepts of Carter’s; not to base any of our pieces on any
of his or directly or indirectly quote any of his work. We debated
for a long time after the sessions were completed whether or not we
would publicly reveal or refer to Carter’s work and the impact
it had on this record. Eventually we decided that we did want to explain
the genesis of the record and did so in the liner notes of the album.
We felt that since the material on this record was so different from
our first two albums that an introduction to the overall concept might
help provide a kind of entrance into the works for listeners. I also
considered that revealing the concept and his influence would be a
good way of acknowledging his work and influence, and in some small
way, showing gratitude to him and his work.
We didn’t know at the time of the recording sessions that he
had passed; we heard of it the following week. He had died literally
while we were in the studio, recording this album that was so influenced
by his work. I was crushed when I found out; I mean, I know he was
103, but it was still upsetting news to me. He was still active and
still writing. I had met him and so I felt his loss not only artistically,
but personally as well.
To answer your question about which music of his was most influential,
for me it’s the string quartets, absolutely. His string quartets,
especially Nos. 1 and 3, were and are an awakening for me. For preferred
recordings, the set on Sony with the Juilliard quartet. Every time
I hear them, they just drop me to my knees; they have a tremendous
impact. I hear something new in them with each listening.
Mark Wingfield: Like Kevin, Elliott Carter has been an influence
for much of my musical life. I still remember the first time I heard
it, I must have been 20 or 21. I was listening on a car radio and
I heard what sounded to me at the time, like a nightmarish orchestral
vortex, a seething mass of sound. It was unlike anything I head heard
in my life, I was completely transfixed. His work has been an influence
ever since. It’s not that I think I have directly referenced
any of his material in my own work, it’s more like the emotion,
spirit and concepts of his work have informed my musical vision.
It did come as a surprise to me when I found out he had passed away
as we were actually recording the album. On a personal level it seemed
an amazing coincidence. Though I don't hold anything by coincidences,
it still has an emotional effect on me when I think about that session.
As Kevin says, we were both in two minds about whether or not to mention
Carter's influence on the music. But in the end we decided that since
we had sat down to record with the explicit idea of basing the music
on Carter's work, it seemed right to mention it.
mwe3: Why did you call the CD Dark Sonatas and can you explain
the concept behind the sonata structure as it applies to the album?
The term “sonata” goes all the way back to the Baroque era
and also 20th century composers used the sonata too. In what ways
did you apply the sonata concept on the new CD and would you say Dark
Sonatas is more jazz based or 20th century neoclassical in form
and structure? Were jazz and classical tonalities applied on the CD?
Who came up with the song titles? They’re not in English which
I noticed!
Kevin Kastning: I suggested that we title the record Dark
Sonatas for a couple of reasons. I felt that some of my tunings
I used on the record, and some of Mark’s patches were rather
dark in densities and atmospheres. I wouldn’t say that there
are any jazz elements on this record; both harmonically and melodically,
as well as structurally, this is more of a 21st century classical
work. In the album title, ‘Sonatas’ to allude to the classical
influence of Elliott Carter, and when I was listening to the rough
mixes of the recording sessions, it occurred to me that some of the
pieces sounded like a 21st century version of violin sonatas in some
places. We didn’t adhere to the rigidity of the sonata form as
it applies to sonatas from the classical period, or even into the
romantic period when the definition of sonata form began becoming
a bit more fluid. While there isn’t a concrete representation
of the typical sonata components such as exposition, development,
and recapitulation; or a three- or four-movement structure, there
is the overall concept of the sonata as a principle, an approach to
shaping a single composition. ‘Sonata’ was also used in
this instance to allude to the classical format of a duet consisting
of piano with a solo instrument. Again, in passages of some of the
pieces, you can almost hear what I’m doing functioning as a piano
part, and what Mark is doing functioning more akin to something like
a violin part.
I
also hear these works as more dense than our previous works. I think
I may have a mild form of synesthesia, and I hear these deep densities
as darker in colors, which also impacted the album title.
The titles are more aligned to the centuries-old classical compositional
naming convention wherein movements within a piece are titled by things
like tempo markings. We went more in this titling direction with this
album due to the modeling of pieces on more of a classical approach.
A few of the titles are in Latin. I think that the album title and
the track titles tie in with and connect the overall work in a cohesive
fashion. Even the artwork on the album cover is an almost tangible
representation of the textures of the pieces and the overall impact.
The photography for the album cover and the CD booklet was all done
by Chris Friel, a British photographic artist whose work I admire.
His work truly fit this album; I think he strongly captured a few
of the elements of its essence.
Mark Wingfield: I would second everything Kevin said here.
Also in many of the pieces there are structures and themes which are
stated, then developed and finally returned to later in the piece.
Actually two or three of the pieces do, to one degree or other, follow
the sonata form in the modern sense of the word, though they were
not planned that way. None of the pieces were planned in anyway apart
from the intention to create music which, in our minds, related to
what Carter's music meant to us. Having said that, before beginning
a piece Kevin and I may decide some basic things like tempo, or whether
we start together or one of us starts first, or perhaps which registers
we start in, but nothing more detailed than that.
mwe3: The Dark Sonatas CD sounds quite dynamic. What recording,
mixing and mastering techniques were applied during the various stages
to ensure the sound didn’t distort or overload the sonic spectrum
so to speak? Do you think most CD players and speakers going back
20 to 25 years ago (vintage audio gear) can handle the sonic load
of the 21st century CD so to speak? What CD players were used to test
the sound characteristics of the album in its recorded medium? I hope
the CD will be around for a long time but with the push being downloads
and what with vinyl making a “comeback” so to speak, I’m
afraid the essence and original intent of the CD is becoming a lost
art form in some regards. Also when can we expect a DVD from you doing
the recordings and what about DVD audio and Blu-ray, how are those
for music in your opinion?
Kevin Kastning: The recording technique was very simple and
pure: microphone into pre-amp into recorder. I didn’t use any
computers in the recording process; my recorder at that time was the
Alesis HD24XR 24-track digital recorder, which is a wonderful piece
of gear. Sadly, not long after the sessions for Dark Sonatas, it
died. It had recorded a lot of albums in the years I had it, and I
was sad to see it go. It’s been replaced with a Tascam X48 Mk.II
48-track digital recorder, which is truly an order of magnitude beyond
the HD24. This recording process makes for a very dynamic recording,
both in frequency response and actual dynamics, as no EQ, limiting,
or compression are used during the tracking process.
Regarding blu-ray, I think it’s a superior medium over the audio
CD. I hope to see it get more widely adopted as a high-resolution
vehicle for recorded music.
Regarding a DVD of Mark and I, there are no plans for that. We do
have some videos on YouTube, and a recent concert performance in New
York City was filmed; no doubt that will find its way to YouTube as
well. We recorded our next album in August 2013, and parts of those
recording sessions were also filmed.
I’ll let Mark speak to the mixing and mastering processes.
Mark
Wingfield: The mastering used the PSP Xeon limiter, which does
not allow any digital clipping. Some older CD players cannot handle
full scale digital and may distort if the digital signal approaches
full scale, but it shouldn't be a problem with older amps and pre-amps
or any reasonable quality modern CD player. The Xeon is the most transparent
limiter I have ever heard, hardware or software. One of the things
that easily confuses the ear is changes in volume. When you limit
a signal, it increases the overall volume. This makes it very difficult
to accurately judge what effect the limiting is having on the sound.
The Xeon has a button which keeps the audible volume the same as you
increase the amount of limiting applied. So you can actually hear
exactly how it is affecting the sound.
Having said this, we made sure that the only limiting used in mastering
was protective. In other words we made sure that only inaudible transients
were limited. So the limiter would only be activated for a small number
of samples a few times during a whole track. Most music these days
has large amounts of limiting applied throughout each track on the
album. This inevitably changes the sound of the original recording
greatly and it also greatly reduces the dynamic range of the music.
For the music we do it was important not to have any reduction in
the dynamic range. As with the mastering, in the mixing, no compression
was used and sound shaping was done with mic balancing, panning and
reverb rather than EQ.
I will greatly mourn the lack of album artwork if the CD disappears.
That is my only problem with downloads, you don't get the full album
artwork and I think that's a great loss. However on every other front
I think downloads are a superior medium. Yes mp3’s are low quality,
but on some services you can download 24 bit wav files and these are
significantly better than CD or vinyl. You are in fact getting an
exact digital duplicate of the mastered album, I can't see how it’s
possible to get higher quality than that! Also with downloads you
can avoid the whole tricky problem of getting the information off
the CD accurately. In terms of sound quality, I'd rather put all my
money into a great digital to analog converter, rather than wasting
half of that on the CD player part of the technology, which is imperfect
at best. So I see downloads as the future in terms of quality, nothing
else can match it. I only wish someone would come up with a clever
way to include the CD artwork with it, but that's pretty problematic.
I believe you can get 24bit on blue ray so that's another option for
going beyond CDs and vinyl in sound quality, but I don't know if it
will catch on in a big way. Going back to vinyl? To my years it’s
just a nostalgia thing, I have no interest in it, it’s an inferior
medium. On vinyl you loose all the stereo in the bass and the dynamic
range is much less than even CD let alone 24 bit digital. Vinyl is
an antique technology with nothing to offer me personally.
mwe3: Kevin’s 30 string guitar is quite prominent on Dark
Sonatas. How did it all blend together for the 30 string guitar
with Mark’s electric guitars? How did you decide which of Kevin’s
guitars, the 30, 16 or 12 string guitar were right for which song
and can Mark say something about the guitars and strings he featured
on the new CD?
Kevin Kastning: That’s a good question. Instrument combinations
were usually arrived at by discussions of Mark’s patch/voice
selection and my tunings, determining which tuning would fit best
with which patch and so forth, even though he only used a couple during
the sessions for Dark Sonatas. I had the 30-string in a different
tuning than the 16- and 17-string Contraguitars, or the 12-string
Alto guitar. And the 16-string was in one of my own intervallic tunings,
different from the 30-string; the 17-string was in octave tuning.
So it wasn’t only a matter of which instrument was right for
which piece, but which instruments fit together the best. Often my
instrument selection and/or tunings had a very direct impact on the
shape and especially coloration of the piece itself. Often I would
have a shape of a composition in mind, or a specific compositional
orchestral texture, and I’d reach for the instrument and tuning
combination that would allow that shape to appear, exist, and breathe.
The strings on all my instruments are by John Pearse.
Mark Wingfield: I actually only used the same patch on most
of the tracks on this album, there are a few where I used another
similar patch. There is one piece called "Sonata di Scuro No.
1" where I momentarily switch in a third patch for a second or
so periodically to create a certain effect, but apart from that almost
every track uses one of two patches. These are based the Roland VG-88
which is a guitar audio effects processor that allows you to go in
a lot deeper to adjust the sound than any other processor I've found.
Some people confuse this with a synth, but it’s got nothing to
do with synthesizers, it’s an audio signal processor that shapes
and processes the guitar signal. The guitar I used was a Patrick Eggle
LA Plus which has been my main guitar for years.
On the recording
session Kevin and I did in August I employed a whole new approach
to sound processing. Although the VG-88 remains at the heart of my
sound, I am now feeding that into a laptop. Once in the laptop I can
bring a whole new pallet of sound shaping devices into play. So for
the August session I had a whole host of processing at my finger tips.
For example I had three different EQs, some subtle distortion and
a limiter which allow me to bring out a breath like sound from my
guitar. I can fade this configuration in and out very subtly while
playing using a Vmeter touch strip attached to my guitar. I also had
two Sinevibes Turbo wave shapers with different settings which I can
switch between and fade in using a pedal. Artemiy Pavlov at Sinevibes
has been great and worked with me on adding some new features for
the Turbo to get the sound I was after. Its a truly innovative company
with great sounding plugins.
I also have a very subtle EQ and distortion channel which I can switch
in on the main guitar sound which consists of three Waves plugins;
an emulation of an SSL desk channel which adds some nice but very
subtle distortion to the texture of the notes, then an 1176 compressor
emulation which again adds some subtle distortion but also affects
the attack phase of the note in a very subtle but pleasing way and
finally an API 550B EQ emulation which adds yet more subtle upper
harmonics and a fair amount of very unique upper mid EQ with tight
Q. Together these add a very nice, but very subtle texture of distortion
to the notes along with some subtle attack shaping and frequency emphasis.
Its a magic combination which works really well with one of the patches
I use. I also used this on one or two tracks on Dark Sonatas. Again
this can all be switched in with a foot pedal connected to the laptop.
One other thing I'm using is an LFO modulated frequency shifter which
I fade in occasionally for a raspy tone. I'm using all these things
live now as well as in the studio.
The fact that laptops are now fast enough so that you can play through
them in real time with no noticeable latency, has really opened things
up for me. I'm using a Macbook Pro Retina with SSD and a TC Studiokonnekt
48 audio interface. The latency with this set up is super low to the
point where it’s the same as the delay I'd get if my amp was
a little way behind me on the stage. As it happens I'm not using an
amp and listening through monitors right next to me or headphones.
So it all feels very natural, I don't detect any latency when playing.
I think software developers are just scratching the surface of what's
possible in terms of expressive effects. Too much of a plugin developer's
energy is spent trying to recreate antique technology in my view.
Perhaps that's where the money is, so I certainly don't blame them
if that's the case. But there are so few developers who are really
doing anything new with this technology and I can't help feeling there
is a huge potential there.
There are companies who really are doing something new like Spectrasonics
who make the Omnisphere synth and some smaller software developers
like Sinevibes and Michael Norris for example. But with most plugin
developers you just see the same old set of effects reproduced time
and again by company after company, each claiming that their sound
more like the antique hardware of the past. I mean I am using some
of this stuff, like the Waves emulations, which are superb, but I
think of them as subtle, but very nice sounding distortion devices
and I use them as such. I'm not knocking Waves, I love their plugins,
I think they're a great company and I totally depend on their plugins.
But I think the doors are wide open in terms of innovation in audio
software and there is so much uncharted territory to be explored.
My advice to any software developer who wants to do something really
innovative for musicians in this field, is to stop thinking in terms
of software or audio techniques, such as frequency shifting, bit crushing,
EQ etc... and start thinking in terms of timbre and musical texture.
Rather than taking a technique like frequency shifting and exploring
that, think of how a musical note could be shaped and reformed in
new, but musically satisfying ways. These might employ a whole host
of techniques. But the musician doesn't need to know how you do it.
What would be useful to a musician would be a slider which says "oboe"
at one end and "trumpet" at the other perhaps. Or a slider
which says "buzz" at one end and "velvet" at the
other. Or "voice" at one end and "hollow pipe"
at the other. These words would be an indication of the timbral direction
the sound shaping of the audio signal would go in. But when the slider
is moved, a whole lot of different techniques would come into play,
formant shaping, wave shaping, EQ, or whatever was needed. Not just
one technique. I think that's the sort of thinking which will produce
truly revolutionary musical processing and move us forward from simply
aping the past.
mwe3:
How are computers used in the recording chain on the Dark Sonatas
CD and being that there were no overdubs and everything was recorded
live, what computer programs did you use to ensure the sonic details
weren’t lost or defeated in the recording process. Are recording
studios becoming a thing of the past? What would Elliott Carter think?
lol
Kevin Kastning: Again, no computers used during the actual
recording sessions and process. Though I do use a hard-disk recorder,
which is arguably a kind of computer, but I’ve not made the transition
to ProTools. I do embrace and welcome the digital recording revolution.
I started work in recording studios well before the digital days,
and I even then I saw analog tape as a very imperfect medium with
loads of limitations and forced tradeoffs. Back when tape was the
only medium, I didn’t like it even then.
One key point that I think gets overlooked is that no matter how far
digital technology progresses, there will never be a “plug-in”
for a great room. In other words, digital is a fine recording medium,
but the recording is only as good as the studio (live room) in which
it was recorded. And there’s the entire issue of microphone selection
and placement, which is massively important, but it all begins in
the actual room itself. Obviously this is more key with acoustic instruments,
but the import of the room itself cannot be overlooked.
I don’t think recording studios will ever be a thing of the past,
though many of the great ones have shut down in recent years. I actually
see our present day as a kind of Renaissance in recording technology.
Mark Wingfield: If you are recording digitally these days you
are recording to hard disk. It makes no difference if you are recording
through an audio interface to a computer or a dedicated hard disk
recorder, which these days has a computer in it anyway. The only thing
that's important here is the quality of the analog to digital converter
you're using. Assuming you have a good quality analog to digital converter,
sound quality is all about mics, mic placement, mic pre-amps, the
sound of the room and the sound of the instruments.
The album was mixed on computer because the only other way do it is
to convert the signal back to analog, where you'll loose some quality,
mix through an analog desk and other hardware, where you'll add some
noise and distortion, and then reconvert it to digital, where you'll
loose some quality again. I can't see the point in that in 2013. Unless
of course your mixing technique requires a physical mixing console
and turning of physical faders and knobs. I totally respect that for
some people this is the case and they get great mixes that way. These
notable exceptions aside, I hear a lot of mixes coming out of the
analog world that to me sound clouded in a subtle haze of analog distortion.
Some people like that. I find it obscures the details. I guess even
that can be an advantage with some music, but I prefer the clarity,
detail and openness of the sound you get mixing in the digital world.
In fact once the signal from the instruments is recorded to digital,
it makes sense to me, to keep it there all the way to the listener's
playback system. If their system can handle your recording sample
rate, say 24 bit 96 KHz, then they are receiving the exact same quality
audio you recorded, mixed and master at.
mwe3: What’s been the reaction to the different albums you’ve
recorded and are there different reactions in different parts of the
planet to your music? Do you receive much support in Asia, Australia
and Europe? Are you planning any live shows or tours to introduce
your music in other parts of the world and are there other plans to
further the exposure for your music in the future?
Kevin
Kastning: Critically, the albums have been really well-received;
some have won some nice awards, too. My 2012 release The Book Of
Crossings with Sandor Szabo was named as one of the Top 10 Albums
of 2012 by Acoustic Guitar magazine, and FAME Magazine listed it in
their top 15 of 2012, so this kind of recognition is very humbling
and I am grateful for it all. The first two records of Mark and I
were both named to New York City radio WFMU’s Favorites of the
Year list for 2011 and 2012. With regards to other countries, Australian
radio and the CBC in Canada have been incredibly supportive. Aside
from Japan, I’ve not had much airplay in Asian countries, at
least of which I’m aware. In the US, NPR stations have been very
supportive of my music for many years now. I also receive airplay
in various European countries, and each time I tour in Europe, I’m
surprised at the size of the audiences and their enthusiasm and their
knowledge of my music. Mark and I have been discussing small-scale
tours for our music in both the UK and North America. Sandor has been
speaking to me about doing another European tour in 2014. My partner
Carl Clements asked if I’d be interested in touring with our
music, and yes I would. It seems that my music does better in Europe
than in the US, and I’m more known in Europe than here. Though
I have received some very touching emails from listeners in the US;
a few have told me how much my music means to them and for this I
am very thankful.
Mark Wingfield: Like Kevin I've been fortunate enough to receive
a lot of accolades from the press. As far as radio play, in the US
I've had NPR air play and as Kevin mentioned WFMU has taken a big
interest in our music, in fact we did a live performance on the Irene
Trudel show, there are videos of that here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3WDZNZ-t5A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1szNNroO1Eg
In the U.K. I get regular BBC air play and also radio play in other
parts of Western Europe. In other parts the world, Japan for example,
I know I sell CDs but I have no idea about radio play. Amazingly,
an old high school friend contacted me recently out of the blue, he'd
heard my music on the radio in Tennessee of all places. I never would
have known this if he hadn't got in touch, so it’s hard to know
exactly where you're getting played.
Some of my albums have also received a lot of critical acclaim, my
recent album Cinema Obscura with Rene von Gruning and Iain
Ballamy was one of the London Jazz top ten albums of the year. Guitar
Player Magazine has run two major features on me, the second one included
Kevin. So all this helps a lot. I feel very grateful for all this
and lucky because the type of music I do often falls between the cracks,
its not exactly rock but its not straight ahead jazz either and there
are classical elements in the composition side of it.
As for touring, I'd love to tour with Kevin and I am hoping we can
arrange U.S. and U.K. tours in the near future.
mwe3:
What plans are shaping up for the next CD and how about other writing
and recording plans for you and your music, labels and various guitar
technologies in the coming months and years?
Kevin Kastning: In August 2013, Mark and I completed recording
sessions for our next album. That will likely be released in early
2014. This one continues our progression, as Mark was using some new
gear which extended his potential for expression and textures. And
for the first time in my life, I used only one instrument for the
entire recording sessions: the Emerald Guitars Kevin Kastning Signature
30-string. I utilized various tunings on it, but everything was recorded
using the 30. While it may seem that limiting myself to one instrument
for a complete recording project is a limitation, the truth is that
the 30-string is so deep and vast that is it anything but a limitation.
It is in fact a very freeing and expansive instrument; it’s like
playing an orchestra instead of a guitar.
For other recording projects, Carl Clements and I return to the studio
in October to begin work on our next album, which will be released
in 2014. Sandor Szabo and I will be starting work on our next album
this fall as well. Actually, we’re working on about three albums
at once, but we’ll be focusing on just one in the fall. This
will be a very different and unusual project for us. If you’ve
been following our projects over the years, you’ll know that
for me to say that this one is going to be unusual is really sayiojects
are confirmed. I have three or four more with other artists that are
tentatively slated for 2014; more news will be available on those
soon. Work on my solo album is also slated to begin late this year;
actually, writing for it is well underway at present.
For instrument projects in the works, I’m working again with
Dan Roberts at Daniel Roberts Stringworks on a 20-string classical.
I’m also working with Emerald Guitars in Ireland on the next
Kevin Kastning Signature model; this will be a 36-string instrument.
I’m very excited about both of these new instruments, and am
sure they’ll both find their way onto my solo album; as well
as the upcoming recording projects and concerts in 2014.
Mark
Wingfield: Kevin and I have at least two more albums worth of
material recorded, we are currently planning to release another one
early in the new year. I am currently recording another album with
harpsichordist Jane Chapman and have two more band albums scheduled.
As for composing I've been asked to write a solo piano piece for the
renowned classical concert pianist Kathryn Stott and I am currently
writing material for the upcoming band albums I mentioned.
Guitar technologies are something I'm exploring on an ongoing basis
so I'm sure more interesting things will happen. I find that new sound
manipulation techniques require new playing techniques, and it takes
time to develop this. Having just opened up some new areas for myself
with sound manipulation on the laptop, I'll explore those for a while
before moving on.
Thanks to Mark Wingfield @ www.MarkWingfield.com
and to Kevin Kastning @ www.KevinKastning.com
{Just after the above interview was finished, mwe3.com spoke to Kevin
Kastning and Mark Wingfield again on the eve of their DROM show in
Manhattan on August 17, 2013. They took some time out from the recording
sessions for their follow up album to Dark Sonatas. Topics ranged
but really, despite my often unfocused rantings on how great Dark
Sonatas is... it was really a friendly phone "do drop in"
call from mwe3 to Kevin and Mark, the latter having just arrived to
the U.S. from London.}
mwe3: Mark, what’s been the reaction to your latest album with
René von Grünig, Cinema Obscura? It’s another
great CD from you.
Mark: Thanks a lot. We had good reactions actually. London Jazz, which
is the main review place now in the U.K. and is an online reviews
site. They made it one of their top ten albums of the year. I was
really pleased about that.
mwe3: You mentioned the economy has impacted your ability to tour
with René and that big band on Cinema Obscura. How has
the economy impacted your music?
Mark: England got hit even worse than America. We’re still in
a bad way over there, in fact people are pretty scared I think. The
average person is left in a very worried situation. It’s not
picked up at all since the crash.
mwe3: How
are you dealing with the problems regarding music downloads which
entails even less of a committment from the record label?
Mark: I agree with you. I think it does cheapen the whole thing. Economically,
it undermines the whole industry.
mwe3: I guess mwe3.com is trying to keep the CD alive! (lol)
Kevin: I don’t really see CD completely going away. People were
predicting the death of vinyl and vinyl never really went away. In
fact, it’s coming back in a lot of circles. I don’t like
the whole downloading alternative however, there are some new sites
like HDtracks.com and some of the classical labels are offering higher
res downloads which I think is a really cool. If there’s anything
cool about downloading, it’s that. Your whole recollection is
gone if your hard drive crashes. I think that’s just ludicrous.
Mark: My personal view is vinyl is just a kind of trendy thing that’s
gonna disappear because I’m not a believer that vinyl offers
an improved quality over CDs. It’s worse in almost every way.
mwe3: How are you going to change your sound on the next record, the
follow up to Dark Sonatas, which you’re recording with
Kevin right now?
Mark: We have changed it! I mean I’ve been working on expanding
my sound and changing my sounds. I’m now playing directly through
a lap top whereas before I wasn’t. On the sessions we’re
doing right now, everything I'm doing is going right through the lap
top. It’s the first recording I’ve done where everything
that’s on there is going through the lap top, using software
plugins and various things to shape the sound and I often manipulate
that as I play using various pedals and things on my guitar and so
forth.
mwe3: Kevin, there’s such a wide difference between amount of
diverse music you’ve recorded with Mark Wingfield who is kind
of a guitar hero, kind of the Hendrix for the 21st century avant fusion
scene, and the airy kind of Oregon-type sound you get with Carl Clements
for example. Do you feel the two sounds puts you in different musical
camps?
Kevin: I don’t know... To me it’s all kind of branches on
the same tree, I guess. I don’t see a lot of difference between
what I do with Carl and what I do with Mark in that, it’s all
in music. It’s music that... it’s not really able to assign
a genre to it. So as far as that goes, I see it as all kind of the
same whole. I have different approaches with each person I work with.
For example, I wouldn’t try to approach the material with Mark
the same way as I would the material with Carl. So I just get into
it more organically to see what the situation calls for and just kind
of allow that chemistry to dictate itself and I just follow along
where it tends to go. Wherever it leads. I would agree with you on
Mark being a guitar hero.
mwe3:
It seems like you and Mark are kind of inventing a new musical language.
Are you hoping people learn to speak it? (lol)
Kevin: It’s an interesting way to put it. Actually, I take that
as a compliment. Thank you.
mwe3: This is 21st century music. Kind of scary don’t you think?
Kevin: Interesting that you say that it’s 21st century music.
Mark and I were influenced by Elliott Carter who is a 20th century
composer, so perhaps the argument could be made that we’re taking
our 20th century influences and bringing them forward into the 21st
century and turning that into what will become the music of the 21st
century, maybe.
mwe3: I was impressed with your guitar sound and I mentioned your
music to Steve Hackett.
Kevin:
I appreciate that you mentioned me to Steve Hackett. He was kind of
a hero of mine when I was a kid growing up.
mwe3: Maybe you should get the Dark Sonatas CD to Steve Howe
to. Too bad YES hardly even has a record label presence in the US
these days.
Kevin: I saw them back in April and they just sounded fantastic. Their
playing is just as strong as ever. It’s really fun,
mwe3: I’m a firm believer in this rising generation of younger
musicians coming up these days.
Kevin: Well, there’ll always be great music. You may have to
look a little harder for it but it’s never going to die, it’s
never going to go away.
mwe3: Good luck at the show tomorrow night. Are you filming it?
Kevin: We are.
